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RE: ND-proxy applicability and loop-prevention

On Tue, 23 Mar 2004, Soliman Hesham wrote:
>  > I don't personally think 100% link utilization is that bad a 
>  > signal.  
> => I think it's a bad signal, _if_ detected. I.e. An average
> user is not even going to know that they have 100% link
> utilisation. And _if_ they do, I actually think that neither
> the user, nor the help desk first line of support will
> have the faintest idea (having been a regular with help
> desk people that work for a couple of major operators
> in different countries).

The user knows that all of his communication attempts fail.  That's a 
good signal that there's something wrong.  If the user knows nothing 
more of this, he calls helpdesk or some support, which may be able to 
identify the problem and eliminate it.

Or, the user could read the manual for the shiny box he bough, and
notice a big warning text "DON'T LINK THESE BOXES EXCEPT IN SERIES
UNLESS YOU DISABLE ND-PROXYING [and instructions how to do it]"

>  > It rather simply conveys that "oops-- I've done something 
>  > wrong when I
>  > added the box there." and after it's removed all starts to work again
>  > -- intuitive.  
> => So if I somehow get inspired or guess that I should 
> remove the proxy and things work, what does that tell me???
> Maybe the device is faulty? Maybe I'll take it back to the 
> shop!

Maybe the shop knows something about how the device operates -- they 
certainly should! -- or you read documentation, which should certainly 
describe this feature.

All in all, it seems that the problem gets noticed and fixed by 
someone and that's what counts.

> There is nothing intuitive about that from an average
> user's perspective. 

For the average user, it doesn't have to be more intuitive than that,
right?  He only cares whether it works or not.  In the first place
99.9% of people wouldn't be plugging these boxes in triangles (or more
complex setups), so this is not commonplace.  If the box "doesn't
work", he complains to someone, and that someone may be able to help.

In the end, the problem gets fixed in one way or the other (probably 
removing the unnecessary box, replacing it with another router, or 
putting the boxes in series, or whatever), and the user who happened 
to add them in the wrong configuration is happy again.

Pekka Savola                 "You each name yourselves king, yet the
Netcore Oy                    kingdom bleeds."
Systems. Networks. Security. -- George R.R. Martin: A Clash of Kings

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